Bin Laden codename: Geronimo

[Phidippides]

Here's an article which discusses why the "Geronimo" codename was used to identify Osama bin Laden in the recent mission in Pakistan.  There's the historical issue with Geronimo, the man:

"Military officials soon branded Geronimo a renegade. During the next decade, Geronimo repeatedly returned to reservation life in peace only to bolt with others for the refuge of the Sierra Madres. They often left a trail of blood. Hidden in the myriad mountain passes and caves, Geronimo and his followers embarrassed military officers by eluding them time and again, at one point with as many as 5,000 US soldiers on their heels."

And then the use of Geronimo's name within popular culture:

According to reports, in 1940 soldiers from the parachute division were preparing to test a daring new manoeuvre, in which men jumped from the plane in rapid succession.

The night before the jump, a small group of soldiers left the base to watch film at the local cinema - a western featuring the fearless Geronimo. As the men later revealed their apprehension about the next day's jump, Pt Aubrey Eberhardt announced that he was going to shout "Geronimo" as he leapt from the plane to demonstrate his courage.

The story goes that as he jumped, "G-E-R-O-N-I-M-O" was clearly heard from the ground. It was copied by other servicemen and quickly became standard parachute regiment practice - and the favoured cry for little boys performing a daring leap.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-us-canada-13265069

[ThatFrontierHistorian]

I saw this same article (and tweeted about it) earlier today.  I do wonder about naming the mission Geronimo; seems a little bit loaded and insensitive, but maybe I am reading too much into it!

[scout1067]

Regardless of the code name used, it is about time we got him.  It will not end terrorism though, I discuss that briefly here.

ThatFrontierHistorian, did you seriously just suggest that the use of the codename "Geronimo" was insensitive and dare I say, politically incorrect?

[Phidippides]

ThatFrontierHistorian, did you seriously just suggest that the use of the codename "Geronimo" was insensitive and dare I say, politically incorrect?

Actually, it crossed my mind that someone might thing that.  I don't really know the history of Geronimo, but if his name is still held highly in some circles, linking him to a terrorist such as Bin Laden could strike a wrong nerve.  I'm not saying it would necessarily be justified, but I could see it happening.

[Aetheling]

Maybe because Geronimo had nothing to do with Bin Laden, it was the most secure code !?

[ThatFrontierHistorian]

ThatFrontierHistorian, did you seriously just suggest that the use of the codename "Geronimo" was insensitive and dare I say, politically incorrect?

Political Correctness doesn't enter into it.  For me this issue touches upon how we think about and contextualise Indians in our past.  The issue, for me, is that it suggests - and I said I am probably reading too much into it - a degree of legitimacy for the actions of the US against the Apache.  Put simply, I do not think it is appropriate to link Geronimo to OBL, or the Apache to AQD.  This is not because it may offend modern Indians (although it's possible, I can't pretend to speak for them) but because it suggests something about the actions taken against Geronimo and his people that I do not think is appropriate.  To put it another way - the hunt for OBL was a legitimate exercise, whereas the hunt for Geronimo and his followers was far more problematic.  Or, if you like, OBL doesn't deserve to be mentioned in the context of Geronimo just as Geronimo does not deserve the the indignity of being mentioned in the context of OBL.

Like I said, I am reading a lot into this and I dare say the government/military did not intend to make any great statement re: how America recognises its own past with regards to the Indians.  But I am not making a comment because of political correctness.  I made the comment I did because this raises an important historical issue; does the naming of this mission suggest that the government still views the Indian wars of the late 19th century as a legitimate exercise comparable to the mission to bring OBL to justice? That was what I meant by insensitive (I admit it was a poor choice of words); this is an important and (I feel) appropriate type of discussion.

All best

[ThatFrontierHistorian]

Maybe because Geronimo had nothing to do with Bin Laden, it was the most secure code !?

Absolutely; like I said I am probably reading too much into it (the naming of Blackhawk helicopters, for example, doesn't suggest anything about Blackhawk or the war he fought) - I don't think it's very important - but it does bring to light a good point for discussion. Assuming there was a direct, intentional link does this suggest something about how (historic) Indians are contextualised? I don't know the answer, but it seems like an interesting question to ask

[Omer]

Maybe because Geronimo had nothing to do with Bin Laden, it was the most secure code !?

Difficult question : however I dont recall how many attempt were launched against OBL but I think they miserably failed because of "unfortunate" leaks ... hence a total secrecy surrounding the last one (not to mention a probable paranoid climate about this last long-breathed hunt)
You might be right when evoking a kind of total blackout even through code-names (all details matter)!

Let's wait for our special ops expert, Scout ! 

[skiguy]

I made the comment I did because this raises an important historical issue; does the naming of this mission suggest that the government still views the Indian wars of the late 19th century as a legitimate exercise comparable to the mission to bring OBL to justice?

Hopefully not, but another question I ask would be did the US government view Geronimo as an equal threat back then just as the current government views (or viewed) OBL now?

[Phidippides]

I truly think that the person or persons in the military who gave OBL the codename "Geronimo" did it without giving it much thought, and the only connection between the actual Geronimo and OBL were that they were both elusive enemy combatants (and Geronimo is a historical name which sounds distinctive and kind of neat to say).  However, that does not sit well with pundits, etc. who have the luxury of (over)analyzing such decisions:

Senate official: Wrong to link bin Laden, Geronimo

I can imagine that there is plenty of language used in the military which is not politically correct, yet which is never expected to be printed on the front pages of newspapers.  It just so happens that this time, it was, and there will probably be some policy adopted in the future which prohibits the use of certain politically-incorrect names for military objectives.

[Omer]

Hopefully not, but another question I ask would be did the US government view Geronimo as an equal threat back then just as the current government views (or viewed) OBL now?

I don't think so  ("beware of eulogy")
If you are right, then this is a big mistake (which I doubt)

[scout1067]

Let's wait for our special ops expert, Scout ! 

Specops expert, I don't think I have ever made that claim.  Military historian yes, snake eater no.

Frontierhistorian, you lost me at contextualize.  And I agree and think you are reading way to much into the codename.  If you try to deconstruct the use of the word you will get lost, just ask Derrida.  It was probably picked because of there is historical significance to the name, even more likely in my view is that it is an easy word to remember and not a word that sounds similar to something in the local language.

[Omer]

Specops expert, I don't think I have ever made that claim.  Military historian yes, snake eater no.

You don't know what you are missing : ... for the brave you can go to specialized snake restaurants and order the king of all snakes, the Cobra.  You can select a size and type of snake you would like from the cages and then the snake is killed in front of you and the blood is drained into a glass along with the bile from the stomach.  The heart of the snake is then removed and also placed in a separate glass. The blood is to be consumed with rice vodka and the still beating heart of the snake to be swallowed whole still beating as it goes down your throat ...   A rare delight ! 

[ThatFrontierHistorian]

I made the comment I did because this raises an important historical issue; does the naming of this mission suggest that the government still views the Indian wars of the late 19th century as a legitimate exercise comparable to the mission to bring OBL to justice?

Hopefully not, but another question I ask would be did the US government view Geronimo as an equal threat back then just as the current government views (or viewed) OBL now?

Good question but as Omer said, I don't believe so; more of an inconvenience, although Geronimo's role in the public imagination was far weightier than any real threat he posed.

Let's wait for our special ops expert, Scout ! 

Specops expert, I don't think I have ever made that claim.  Military historian yes, snake eater no.

Frontierhistorian, you lost me at contextualize.  And I agree and think you are reading way to much into the codename.  If you try to deconstruct the use of the word you will get lost, just ask Derrida.  It was probably picked because of there is historical significance to the name, even more likely in my view is that it is an easy word to remember and not a word that sounds similar to something in the local language.

I'm not really reading too much into it, I'm just throwing it out there as a means of generating a discussion; it doesn't particularly bother me.  That said, if the operation had been carried out by the British government and the codename was William Wallace it would have really upset a lot of people, certainly a lot of the people I know (bear in mind I am Scottish).  To my eyes I could not imagine the British government ever using a codename like that precisely because it would carry a lot of dubious implications.  That said, I have no doubt that this is probably just a codename with little thought having gone into it, but in some ways that is an interesting point of discussion - that Geronimo can be used as a codename with little thought.  In at least some cases it appears that code names are picked very carefully: "shock and awe" doesn't seem like an arbitrary choice to me.

Again, I'm not trying to start a discussion about political correctness, but rather the use of Geronimo as an image, the ideas and connotations that spring to mind

[ThatFrontierHistorian]

Saw this and thought it appropriate to share: Chief of the Fort Sill Apache writes an open letter to the president complaining about the codename Geronimo: http://www.fortsillapache-nsn.gov/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=61:letter-to-president-about-geronimo&catid=7:tribal-news&Itemid=13